I don't agree with any type of restriction in a lottery zone. Lottery areas should be able to party hunt and should not subject to any restrictions on antlers or the like. Nothing should change there until the population comes back up. In intensive harvest areas and even in management areas, I don't think that there is any need for party hunting and would not be totally opposed to antler restrictions or moving the season back 1 week. Zone 3 is tough, lots of deer, two seasons, would take some serious retooling of the system. The problem with part hunting in IH or Managed areas is that it is not used to take another doe anymore, they are used to tag multiple bucks. I think if we could limit everyone in those zones to one buck a year, we would see a huge increase in mature deer, and we wouldn't have to change any rule, just enforce the one that we already have.

But here is the problem, this is just one more in a large array of opinions on what a trophy deer is. The next guy wants more points, the next guy wants deer to score high, the next guy just wants to put something in the freezer. Who is right?

I don't think the DNR will ever impose antler restrictions, I just think too many are agaist it, the DNR wants the majority of hunters happy so it is something we will have to live with and I am fine with that.

However, times are changing and more and more people are tired of the same old school deer management. Moving the gun season back and eliminating party hunting are two small steps that are going to save a lot of bucks and help balance the age structure. These two rule changes should keep everyone happy, you can shoot what you want but some of the bucks are given a break. The meat hunters already have everything they could ask for, why not give a little and meet somewhere in the middle.

Wow DaveT, between this post and your Kansas hunt you sure get people here riled up...I love it! I also mostly agree with everything you have to say.

Pesonally, I don't think it would be any harder than trying to figure out if a point is 3" high or not. It is generally pretty easy to distinguish a mature buck at the first glimpse you get. And I'm not talking about those "tv" type hunts with broadside standing deer and wide open fields to shoot. I do think an antler restriction would reduce the "I saw brown" type shooters.

I find it amusing the reluctance that people have to try something new. If you look at it, what are you giving up. For an experienced hunter it's the opportunity to shoot a 1 1/2 year old buck. And that is only for ONE year. In areas that give out antlerless tags, you can still get all the backstraps you want. I'd about bet that the vast majority of hunters see 3+ deer a year in a total deer season. What are the odds that those 3 will all be little bucks, pretty slim. Note, this is only my experience in areas that have a week long plus season.

The main intent isn't to have more "trophy" bucks as one person put it, but a better balanced deer her. It just so happens that a more balanced deer herd will result in having more bucks of an older age.

If it is not trophy bucks you are looking for, then why the interest in a "more balanced deer herd"? Just wondering what other benefit there is to it?

I am all favor of ending party hunting and moving the deer season our a few weeks. MN can grow big dear, and it has been proven in areas that receive little hunting pressure or are protected ares with special hunts (ie parks within the metro area)

I am all in favor of hunting for meat. Venison is tasty, and good for you. But, meat hunters have tons of opportunities for killing a deer for meat. Bowhunting, rifle, blackpowder, not too mention special season hunts. Why not have a doe only "meat" license? Then you get your meat? Try hunting a trophy in this state, and it all comes down to hunting pressure on public land or buying as much land as possible and start you own qdm program. I vote for a simple change in party hunting and season any day.

Then we are all happy-

A more pronounced rut, where the bulk of does come into estrus in a shorter period of time and mature bucks do more of the breeding, vs a trickle rut where does are bred late and smaller bucks and spikes are born later the following year, thus perpetuating the cycle, would be one benefit.
Who moved my cheese? I think that's the main fear here, fear of change. In this case change would be good for all, but because a few like it just the way it is means it's bad. We used to have slavery at one time too, didn't we?

Why is it all everyone ever talks about is moving the gun season. I'll hunt no matter when it is, BUT if you move the gun season later, you will have less participation. Every season that has a poor weather opener, the hunter numbers are down. If you move it back, to say this week, the DNR would sell a lot less licenses. Also, there are parts of MN that don't hold much, if any deer once the crops are completely harvested or the forage is covered with snow. This leads to more ground being worthless, in turn leading to more pressure on other hunting areas. Lastly, if we are for moving the gun season to protect more bucks, then I say we close the bow season for that time as well. No hunting means the bucks are protected. Moving the gun season sure sounds like catering to the bow hunters to me.

Well the main benefit of a more managed herd is healthier fawns. First off you get does bred by mature bucks. Ones that have shown they have the right instincts, senses, genetics to survive. It you clip them off when they are young and dumb you will never know if you've got the right one, only the ones that happen to still be alive and available.

The other benefit is it creates a shortened but more intense breeding season. A shortened breeding season means the doe gets bred early, giving the fawn more time to develop and handle winter conditions. If you've got healthier deer to start with you can lessen those boom/bust type years you can have with tough winters.

the theory of: its brown its down, i'm convinced those people are bleeding heart liberals. they only want hunting laws to work their way, theres no give and take to help their fellow sportsman out. they won't think to themselves "you know what i got does for meat and half the hunters in the field would like to grow bigger bucks, so i'll do my share to help out for a couple seasons and see the results, it just might be good. why should i fight them,theres enough people trying to take away our hunting heritage".....bottom line is liberal sportsman not joining the brotherhood of sportsman.

If moving the gun season back would be a reason people won't buy a license and hunt then it sounds like their problem to me...makes absolutely no sense! That's like saying if the open water fishing opener was moved back 2 weeks, people wouldn't fish or like me saying "Ice fishing is my favorite thing to do, but I wish it wasn't during the winter...it's just too darn cold". If that's you, then hunting isn't your passion...heck it isn't even a hobby of yours!
I realize that revenue is created by license sales, but it's not like MN (at least the last time I checked or heard of, correct me if I'm wrong here)is like the state of AZ where the game and fish in that state is solely dependent on the sales of licenses and tags!

Iowa allows/endorses party hunting to help keep the deer population under control and they are a trophy buck factory. We need to shift our rifle season to where it was years ago and where Iowa's is now--post rut. Party hunting is not a factor- Iowa proves that.

Lakevet

Thanksgiving week used to be the week of deer season. It was a time for our family to get together, give thanks and hunt. We still do that, just can't hunt (muzzleloader) til the weekend after Thanksgiving day. It would be nice to take the kids hunting on the days they are out of school for Thanksgiving break. It might increase participation of kids. I believe Wisconsin season is this way.

Lakevet

First off, if you actually read my post, I said "I'll hunt no matter when it is." And if you think license sales isn't a big deal to the DNR you are kidding yourself. I just see that as one factor on why the season will not be changed. You are right, license sales and tags aren't the only thing keeping the DNR going, but they won't be able to provide their services without them. I hunt plenty of days each year, but to say an opinion doesn't matter unless hunting is a "passion" of yours is crazy. The guy/gal/kid who hunts only one day a year has just as much right to voice their opinions as the guys who hunts every day of each season. Not trying to start an argument, just stating a position.