How can people be that stupid I go way out of my way to stay away from people when there fishing I feel bad if I pull up 75 yards from some one fishing. I guess I just try realy hard not to [PoorWordUsage] anyone off when there fishing I know it makes me mad when someone comes pulling up to my spot. JUST CRAZY

What's really fun is to put out a marker without any weight on it. As it drifts away, the boats follow it.

Now that is funny stuff! I have got to do that. Man I laughed out loud when I read that.

The key word in "maximum sustainable yield" is "sustainable". The bag limit and size restrictions are in place to keep this fishery sustainable. Sure it is disapointing to have to release a nice fish knowing that a small pecent end up dying. But you know as well as I do that any regulation that allowed keeping a "deep-hooked 20 incher" that you think may die anyway would create a loop hole you could drive a truck through, and result in the harvest of countless thousands of pounds of future spawners.

The walleye harvest isnt as prominent a problem as the crappie harvest- which is likely to have its consequences in the not-so-distant future. The daily limit (15 i beleive?) allows for fisherpeople to fillet every dinner plate that reaches the boat. At the pace we're at now, the Red Lake crappie population will dwindle to nothing. In fact, it has already begun. The crappie glory days of old are now becoming few and far in-between. Anyone who was apart of the pre-opener crappie madness can agree with me on that one. Let me state that, personally, I am and have always been a catch-photo-release fisherman. It saddens me to see 5-gallon buckets, filled with crappie, hitting the fish cleaning house.

Maximum Sustained Yield was dropped as the hot fisheries management technique during the 70's for a reason. Without getting this thread off topic (not that is was ever on), it has way too many assumptions that are more likely to be untrue than true. Red Lake will never become a MSY lake, nor will any other inland MN lake. That sort of utilitarian mindset is better suited for commercial fishing. Theoretically its great for recreational fishing, but just never seems to follow the models when nature does her thing.

As far as hooking mortality, consider the tradeoff. Kelly has it figured out

Protected fish are your spawners. Minnesota's major walleye lakes are likely to start slots at 17, 18, or 20 inches and above to protect those spawners. Are there tradeoffs in balancing forage or in hooking mortality? Absolutely. But having a chance to get off a decent spawn each year is worth the minor inconveniences. Four years later you get a crack at momma's crop of perfect 14-16" eaters, and often in large numbers.

Crappies and crappie harvest on Red...a dead horse to beat. I feel for the regulars on this board having to deal with the Big 3: Questions on 1) auger extensions 2) restricting crappie harvest and 3) arguing over Red Lake walleyes, past and present.

Red just isn't a crappie lake. It will not be forced and nature will have its way.

It would'nt hurt to extend out a no fishing within, no wake, wide enough and flared out at the end, Navigable Channel, well marked with buoys and chains between them...yes I realize the waves would be trouble for the anchor system, but it could be done...

Both the slot and simple, "see how many you can catch in a day" mentality, has contibuted to Mortality...and the DNR relaxed the definition for sorting possession last year, allowing more time for picture taking out of water...

Anyway, I wish those pesky White Tipped Perch, would get thinned out enough for the only real trophy fish, the Slabs, to make a come back...

So, hows the crappie fishing?

Well put.

Riverrat, the crappie fishing is still going, the cold and wind has slowed them down a little but we are still seeing some decent numbers/action on the crappie front.

The biggest part of the problem in my opinion is that the DNR has decided it will control who people think. When we leave the principle of wildlife management that have served the conservation movement well ofr 100 years, for whatever the "hot fisheries management topic" is for the day, we are sealing our own doom with regard to our rights to fish.

Yes I studied fish and wildlife management in the 1970's. I studied policies that hasd been in place since the beginning of the conservation movement in the early 1900's. Those policies were responsible for the massive successes we have seen in fish and wildife conservation. And I can tell you that what we have today is a house of cards that is going to come crashing down. Minnesota unfortunately is one of the leaders in this and where they are leading us I guarantee you we do not want to go. But we probably won't find out until we get there.

I like to eat fish. I like to catch fish to eat. We have a scenario that the DNR has set up that they have prioritized catch and realease over fishing for food. That is a very dangerous precident. How do you defend that to the growing numbers of animal right fanatics? Even people who do not fish, and lean towards being anti-hunting/fishing/trapping will usually accept that people should have the ability to catch fish to eat. Of course the extremee vegans our out of the equation. But I am talking about the average person out of touch with nature who lives in a city, who has the same vote as you do doesn't have a clue about fisheries management, but when presented with the issue of catching fish and releasing them compared to catching fish for the table... they aren't going to buy it. It is going to come back to hurt us big time.

I'm telling you that catching fish and releasing them when some of them are going to die is an undefensible position both biologically and ethically. Print this off and pull it out 10-15 years from now and see what you think of it then.

Of course the alternative to releasing fish when some of them are going to die, is keeping everything you catch and insuring that all of them will.

Slot limits may limit the amount of fish you can bring home, but they will increase the amount of fish available to catch. I fish with my boys who are young. They have only known "slot limits" so they except them. Us older folks grew up keeping almost all that we caught until we had our limit. Does that make it right or better?? Not really, it is just what we knew. I still keep fish for meals and my kids love to fish. "Slot limits" have not tempered their fun at all. But does it help to protect the fish for thier future, of course and that is why the DNR does it. People that say "I spent $100 bucks in gas to get here im keeping everything" in my mind miss the point of fishing. I relax, enjoy the time on the water and forget about work, problems and the such. It is that take mine home attitude that makes people plant their boat in front of the river and cast at your boat as you drive out into the lake because they are so close to the channel.

I had been reading this thread and finding it very intersting, but as usual did not intend to reply. But on the way home this morning, I heard a certain ex-twin on the radio live from Red lake. He was pimping the heck out of Red lake. It was very interesting, and cool to hear. He was out there with a walleye pro that we all would know. When the walleye pro got on the air, he mentioned the fact that his boat caught and release 136 walleye the day before. That REALLy got me thinking about this thread and the lake. It makes me ask the question to guys whop live off the lake (Kelly, Jon, and others....) Do you like that kind of PR for the lake? It seems like a double edege sword. You get people out there, which is obviously good for the economy. But did they really need 136 to get their 9 keepers (guessing 3 guys in a boat). How many will die of those that get returned to the water?

Lastly, I have ice-fished the lake for 3 years. I actually enjoyed it so much, I talked the misses into letting me get a wheelhouse/camper. I have seen Jon and Kelly up there before, but never said a word to them. But I wanted to say it here, Thanks for what you do! I can only imagine the idiots you folks deal with. Last year I listened to 2 guys talk on the radio about what a "Cake" job it was plowing roads for a living. And listened to them do the math about how much money you must make.... I have never done work like that, and I found it insulting. So thanks for what you do. Because of the hard work, I can bring my 6year old up next winter (don't have a boat) and watch the huge smile whenhe catches his first Walleye.

No name calling so I don't get chastised by Jonny again but didn't realize I needed to search wiki to discover my true identity. I'm just in awe that here in Shakopee (in the shadow of the IDS tower) that I get to watch combines work from my deck and watch several groups of hunters on duck opener while I walk the hounds.

Really would be interesting to see a geographical breakdown of violations on Red. Citiots (I can use that one cause it's directed at myself) should be running away from the pack due to our sheer masses and incredible stupidity... right? Bet a rack of ribs and beverages at Tall Tales? Insert lots of toothy grins and winkies where you deem neccessary.

You are right on GoFish4. People seem to look past what really matters most when it comes to the great outdoors.

later,
toddb