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#1398864 - 05/12/08 08:49 PM Re: What can be done? [Re: broodwich]
MetroWalleye Offline
FishingMN Family

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 119
Loc: Minneapolis, MN
Originally Posted By: broodwich
And what exactly is the problem? Is there not enough walleye in Mille Lacs? I've fished that stinking lake for 3 summers and I caught more walleye in one month then I have in a lifetime in the Detroit lakes area. The population is stable and through great work between GLFWIC and the DNR there will be for years to come. I say this because I have faith in our DNR and with GLFWIC. Mille Lacs band is a lot more responsible when it comes to their resources then you think. As for your question on what they do with the fish that they net... Why do you need to know? I imagine it ends up in the same place as the other 300,000+ pounds of walleye harvested by anglers... The dinner table...


Tell that to the resort owners on Mille Lacs, if they weren't so angry, they'd probably laugh at you.

My opinion is shaped by my experiences, and my experiences have shown that many fish that are netted or speared go to waste instead of going to a dinner table.

If they want to put fish on the dinner table, there is no reason why they shouldn't catch their fish like everyone else does. Creating separate rules for people based on race is wrong, no matter what the history is.



Edited by MetroWalleye (05/12/08 08:53 PM)

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#1398884 - 05/12/08 09:05 PM Re: What can be done? [Re: MetroWalleye]
shackbash Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Specialist

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 4960
Loc: 37 minutes from Mille Lacs
MetroWalleye,

Are you speaking on behalf of the Mille Lacs Resort Owners?
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#1398930 - 05/12/08 09:24 PM Re: What can be done? [Re: shackbash]
MetroWalleye Offline
FishingMN Family

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 119
Loc: Minneapolis, MN
Originally Posted By: shackbash
MetroWalleye,

Are you speaking on behalf of the Mille Lacs Resort Owners?


No I'm not. But I've seen plenty of them quoted in news stories, and the story is always the same. They are hurting and many of them are saying that netting by Native Americans is hurting their business. The pound allotment for anglers has gone down 142,000 lbs this season, but has gone up 22,500 lbs for the Mille Lacs Band. Fair? I don't think so.

If you don't believe me, stop by a resort along 169 or 47 and ask them.

Here is an article written by Dennis Anderson (Star Tribune) back in January that pretty much sums up my opinion on this topic.

http://www.startribune.com/sports/outdoors/15090121.html


Edited by MetroWalleye (05/12/08 09:44 PM)

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#1399063 - 05/12/08 10:48 PM Re: What can be done? [Re: MetroWalleye]
upnorth Online   happy
HotSpotOutdoors Specialist

Registered: 03/21/02
Posts: 4821
Loc: Chisholm, MN USA
Something that I think some folks are forgetting is that their fishing and how they do it is right grant by the federal govt, ours is a paid for privilege from the state. The feds are always going to supersede the state. And to reiterate this was an agreement for them to give up their land peacefully many years ago, so now it is inconvenient for some and we should repeal it? I personally wouldn't want to go back on my word like that.
_________________________
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#1399091 - 05/12/08 11:19 PM Re: What can be done? [Re: upnorth]
john.wells Offline
Sr FishingMN Family

Registered: 01/12/06
Posts: 675
Loc: chisago county
Here is a news feed from the Minnesota DNR
http://news.dnr.state.mn.us/index.php/20...through-may-16/

If taking walleyes when they are concentrated during the spawn was no big deal, then they would never have a closed season or create special emergency measures such as this.

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#1399116 - 05/13/08 12:17 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: MetroWalleye]
broodwich Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Family

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 77
Loc: Detroit Lakes
Originally Posted By: MetroWalleye
Tell that to the resort owners on Mille Lacs, if they weren't so angry, they'd probably laugh at you.


Why should I care what the resort owners think or feel? They run a business if they fail thats their problem not mine. They have no say in this matter, and they shouldn't.

As for your experience with wasted fish. I see the same thing from anglers.

If for some reason the walleye population tanks then we are all to blame.

As for the original question "What can be done?" The answer is nothing. This whole get the state reps. involved is a waste of yours and their time. I get the impression from many of you that this isn't only about netting. Look, it's stated in the treaty that the Native Americans are allowed to net. This is part of our history, and it's so much bigger than you and me. I never wanted to bring this up before but I feel many choose not to understand that much of the land that was given to the Natives was taken through trickery, fraud, intimidation, and even theft. Some of this activity was from our own government. So why is the netting such a big deal to you guys? Allowing a small number of people to net is a small price to pay for the mistakes our government has made.

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#1399159 - 05/13/08 06:01 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: broodwich]
chasineyes Online   content
HotSpotOutdoors Family

Registered: 01/13/08
Posts: 99
Loc: Shakopee, MN
What would happen if the state would stop stocking the lake with our tax dollars???? Or better yet why not stock a lake that is not within the Indian boundary?

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#1399163 - 05/13/08 06:16 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: chasineyes]
Moe Szyslak Offline
FishingMN Family

Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 161
Loc: MN
I guess when gas hits $8 a gallon, Mille Lacs might as well be like Red because Im not driving that far grin

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#1399186 - 05/13/08 06:50 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: chasineyes]
lucky_nuggets Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Family

Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 38
Originally Posted By: chasineyes
What would happen if the state would stop stocking the lake with our tax dollars???? Or better yet why not stock a lake that is not within the Indian boundary?


Fact check. Call the MN DNR and GLIFWC and ask who is stocking lakes in the ceded territory. Particularly ML

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#1399195 - 05/13/08 07:07 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: lucky_nuggets]
liljohnson Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Family

Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 64
For the people on here who want to no what gives them the right to nett on this post heres a little hint. Look down no matter where your at in north America that piece of land your standing on was one time "Indian" land(I hate the term we are not indians). Threw a series of treaties (Some hornored and some not) it became in the possesion of the United States. We gave up alot for this country! And for us to retain only a small percent of what we used to own should outrage a few people is obsurd! That news story should have a follow up and show where that fish goes! The people dont go threw all that hard work just to waste the fish! It feeds elders and is used at ceremonies and funerals. Some of you should just realize ( or understand)what the ojibway gave up. Maybe it might help you cope with all this. thanks


Edited by liljohnson (05/13/08 07:07 AM)

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#1399274 - 05/13/08 08:03 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: lucky_nuggets]
Black_Bay Offline
Sr FishingMN Family

Registered: 09/30/05
Posts: 864
Loc: Up Yonder
Originally Posted By: lucky_nuggets
Originally Posted By: chasineyes
What would happen if the state would stop stocking the lake with our tax dollars???? Or better yet why not stock a lake that is not within the Indian boundary?


Fact check. Call the MN DNR and GLIFWC and ask who is stocking lakes in the ceded territory. Particularly ML


The Mn DNR stocks Mille Lacs with muskies only, nothing else. Some of the other lakes in the ceded territory are stocked with walleyes, muskies etc.
_________________________
If you're more than a mile from Rainy Lake you're a million miles from home.

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#1399309 - 05/13/08 08:26 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: Black_Bay]
lucky_nuggets Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Family

Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 38
That was my point.

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#1399310 - 05/13/08 08:27 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: broodwich]
john.wells Offline
Sr FishingMN Family

Registered: 01/12/06
Posts: 675
Loc: chisago county
Originally Posted By: broodwich
Originally Posted By: MetroWalleye
Tell that to the resort owners on Mille Lacs, if they weren't so angry, they'd probably laugh at you.


Why should I care what the resort owners think or feel? They run a business if they fail thats their problem not mine. They have no say in this matter, and they shouldn't.

As for your experience with wasted fish. I see the same thing from anglers.

If for some reason the walleye population tanks then we are all to blame.

As for the original question "What can be done?" The answer is nothing. This whole get the state reps. involved is a waste of yours and their time. I get the impression from many of you that this isn't only about netting. Look, it's stated in the treaty that the Native Americans are allowed to net. This is part of our history, and it's so much bigger than you and me. I never wanted to bring this up before but I feel many choose not to understand that much of the land that was given to the Natives was taken through trickery, fraud, intimidation, and even theft. Some of this activity was from our own government. So why is the netting such a big deal to you guys? Allowing a small number of people to net is a small price to pay for the mistakes our government has made.


I think the beef is with how the netting is done. Are the nets, boats, and other apparatus handcrafted as would have been "traditional"? It would seem to me that that would be a big part of the process and method. I have no problem with netting, but put the whole package together. I am big on keeping traditions alive, and I don't begrudge any human what is rightly theirs. Rest assured we are all ancestors of the people who were either wronged or did the wronging. To be sure, there will always be a few people who spoil it for anyone, I don't care what color or heritage they come from. I think everyone learned a big lesson with the walleye collapse on Upper and Lower Red- Nobody wants that to happen again, and it probably won't. But, if it does, we have proven that by working together the problem can be solved. With luck and good graces, and also good management, we will all enjoy good harvests on Mille Lacs!

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#1399403 - 05/13/08 09:21 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: broodwich]
MetroWalleye Offline
FishingMN Family

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 119
Loc: Minneapolis, MN
Originally Posted By: broodwich
Originally Posted By: MetroWalleye
Tell that to the resort owners on Mille Lacs, if they weren't so angry, they'd probably laugh at you.


Quote:
Why should I care what the resort owners think or feel? They run a business if they fail thats their problem not mine. They have no say in this matter, and they shouldn't.


You don't have to care about the local economy around Mille Lacs, but many of us do. These resort owners work their tails off to make sure families that come up to visit have a great time. Many of these resorts were handed down through their families, and it's a shame to see them suffer because of this.

[quote]As for your experience with wasted fish. I see the same thing from anglers.


I've been fishing for over 35 years, and have never seen fish wasted by anglers to this degree.

Quote:
If for some reason the walleye population tanks then we are all to blame.


How can "we all" be to blame, if "we" are only keeping two fish, while the netters can take over 700 lbs each with zero regards to size and type of fish?

Quote:
I get the impression from many of you that this isn't only about netting.


The easiest way to get someone to shut-up you don't agree with when you are talking about different cultures or races, is to call them a racist. I'm not a racist, and my opinion has nothing to do with race. It's about fundamental fairness. The argument can be made that the real racists are the people who want different rules for people based on their racial heritage. I'm not one of those people.

Quote:
I never wanted to bring this up before but I feel many choose not to understand that much of the land that was given to the Natives was taken through trickery, fraud, intimidation, and even theft. Some of this activity was from our own government. So why is the netting such a big deal to you guys? Allowing a small number of people to net is a small price to pay for the mistakes our government has made.


I'm very aware of the injustices that the Native Americans have suffered at the hands of our govt over the past couple hundred years. I think most people are. But like I said before, two wrongs don't make a right. We've seen the harmful effects of tribal netting on lakes, and to simply stand by and not say anything while our fisheries are being damaged is ludicrous.

Why can't the Native American tribes develop a better way of netting fish? With the advances in technology couldn't a net be developed that would only take the smaller walleyes and nothern, in other words, the better eating fish? If they could leave the big breeding females alone as well as the big pike and musky, it wouldn't be so bad, IMO.


Edited by MetroWalleye (05/13/08 09:23 AM)

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#1399412 - 05/13/08 09:27 AM Re: What can be done? [Re: liljohnson]
MetroWalleye Offline
FishingMN Family

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 119
Loc: Minneapolis, MN
Originally Posted By: liljohnson
For the people on here who want to no what gives them the right to nett on this post heres a little hint. Look down no matter where your at in north America that piece of land your standing on was one time "Indian" land(I hate the term we are not indians). Threw a series of treaties (Some hornored and some not) it became in the possesion of the United States. We gave up alot for this country! And for us to retain only a small percent of what we used to own should outrage a few people is obsurd! That news story should have a follow up and show where that fish goes! The people dont go threw all that hard work just to waste the fish! It feeds elders and is used at ceremonies and funerals. Some of you should just realize ( or understand)what the ojibway gave up. Maybe it might help you cope with all this. thanks


Most of us are extremely aware of the injustices suffered by the Native Americans over the past few hundred years....but answer this question, don't you see the harm that netting can do to a lake, as evidenced by what happened at Red Lake? In a year when walleye counts are down, and the anglers have had their pound allotment cut close to 150,000 lbs, how can you justify the taking of an ADDITIONAL 22,500 lbs by netting? Don't you see the potential harm to the lake for future anglers and netters, alike?


Edited by MetroWalleye (05/13/08 09:29 AM)

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